Egalitarian Does NOT Mean Misogynist

Okay, I’m going to go on a bit of a rant here about something that has really been bothering me lately.

Namely, that various people somehow have reached the conclusion that “egalitarian” is a code word for “misogynist”. As someone who doesn’t consider themselves a woman-hater, but does believe in egalitarianism, this is a major issue. So, let’s start off with a standard definition, shall we? What is “egalitarian” defined as? If we use the online Merriam-Webster site, it is either
1. a belief in human equality especially with respect to social, political, and economic affairs
OR
2. a social philosophy advocating the removal of inequalities among people.

Both of these are things I support and would fight for. Indeed, there has been many a time when I’ve spoken up (in real life as well as online) in regards to equality for all. People are people in my book, and treating others disrespectfully or as “lesser” because of religions, chromosomes/genitals, sexual orientation, gender, class, ethnicity, height, disabilities, skin color, or any other factors is absolutely ridiculous. But take a quick look online, and you’ll see that a number of writers hold a very different opinion:

What is the difference between a feminist and an egalitarian? (from a blog) In theory, nothing. In practice, people who say they are egalitarian but not feminist are people who believe in the equality of all people, but quietly don’t include women in the category “people”. (Though, to be fair, I find they’re usually racist, too, and if you push them hard enough, they tend to have a very narrow definition of “people” that usually only covers people that look like them.) They do this because they find it convenient to relegate women to a servant class and good for their ego to assume that they are better than half the human race simply because nature flipped a coin and they came up “male”.
Tarnished says: If anyone claims to be egalitarian but then proceeds to support sexism and/or racism, guess what? They aren’t an actual egalitarian. Were I to meet such a person, I’d assume they were either;
A) an idiot using words they don’t understand to describe themselves, or
B) attempting to create a straw egalitarian to mock/discredit people who really hold that position.
Needless to say, I do not believe that human beings only include white people, nor do I believe that those who share my chromosomal makeup should be thought of as inferior.

Why egalitarianism is bullshit (from a tumblr page)
I usually come across the term “egalitarian” when a person claims they want equality, but feminism is a no-no, because feminism ignores/oppresses men. Egalitarianism focuses both on men and women and would treat them equally.

That’s bullshit.

You have to keep in mind that two people of different status cannot ever be treated equally to be equal. Feminism focuses of women because, in order to achieve equality, we must elevate the status of women to that of men. We can’t focus on them both.
Here’s a visual: Imagine being a parent of two kids. You give Kid 1 and Kid 2 three candies each. Kid 1 steals two of Kid 2’s candy, so Kid 1 has now five while Kid 2 has one. The egalitarian approach would be to give both kids equal amount of candy, say, three again, which would result to Kid 1 having eight, and Kid 2 having four. Not equal. Feminism would give Kid 2 the necessary amount of candy to make sure Kid 2 has as much candy as Kid 1. That’s fucking equality.
Tarnished says: Uh, no. If you have a kid that has taken candy from another, you punish them and don’t give them more. Hence the reason we have laws that protect employees from discrimination. What was that definition again? Oh, yeah…”a social philosophy advocating the removal of inequalities among people”. Egalitarians like myself understand that there are still inequalities between the sexes, and work to rectify both, not just one. The only way that this writer’s stance would work is if men had a superior status to women in all areas of society. Since they do not, and suffer from their own particular inequalities, I believe fighting for the betterment of both sexes is necessary.

Is there actually a difference between egalitarianism and feminism? (from a different tumblr page)
Yes.
Egalitarians seem to think everyone needs to be treated equally regardless of power structures, imbalances, and oppression.

Feminists believe we need to protect those that are being oppressed and liberate them from those oppressive forces.

Basically, one sounds all nicey-nicey and nobody has to take any accountability for the problems of society meaning nothing ever changes, and the other actually gets things done.
Tarnished says: Exactly how does egalitarianism not take present day problems into account? Is there any proof of this, or is the writer simply saying this to push their own ideology? I’d like to see some citations of true egalitarians (not closet racists and sexists) who have stated that everyone is starting out on equal footing, so I can tell them how incorrect and socially blind they are. The way I see it, we need to accept the fact that everyone should be treated equally as much as possible, and work towards that goal…in spite of power imbalances, not by pretending they don’t exist.

Feminism vs Egalitarian (from yet another blog)
Worryingly, the trend for “any label besides feminist” which seems to be on the increase, in my experience, actually perpetuates patriarchal dominance and oppression of women. When you say “I believe in equality for all, I’m an Egalitarian!” aren’t you essentially saying “Well, I actually do support the founding principles of feminism, but I’m too scared to call myself a feminist because society says it’s a bad thing to be. I’m just going to label myself as something altogether more fuzzy and less confrontational because conforming to patriarchy is easier than standing up to challenge it!”? Is it really in the interests of the equality you believe in to be a feminist in denial?

If you support equality for women with the rights and opportunities that men are already afforded by society, you’re a feminist. It’s time to stop being scared, stop being in denial and actually make a difference. Feminists come in all sorts of different packages and that’s the beauty of the movement. It doesn’t matter what gender you are, what sex you are, who you’re attracted to, what the colour of your skin is or whether you have a disability – you are still a feminist if you believe women should be equal with men.
Tarnished says: Ah, but what if one believes men should also be equal to women too? I do not call myself an egalitarian instead of a feminist because I’m “afraid”…it’s because I do not agree with certain core parts of the ideology and I find it to be in bad taste to claim to be something I’m not. I wouldn’t call myself a feminist any more than I’d call myself a Christian or a democrat.
Again, I’m unsure of what reality these bloggers experience, but men (at least 99% of the ones I’ve known in my 30 years of life) are not being massaged and fanned by gorgeous women feeding them sun ripened grapes off a golden tray while their female relatives have to scrounge a meager living as dirt farmers. For the most part, we each have parts of society that work in our favor, just as other parts work against us. Women have some inequalities that need to be addressed, but they do not hold a monopoly on “Crappy Things That Need To Change”.

If feminists want to solely focus on fixing women’s issues (without also making life more unfair for men), they should be able to.
If men’s righters want to solely focus on fixing men’s issues (without also making life more unfair for women), they should be able to.
And if egalitarians want to divide their activism between the two, then where is the shame in that?

Thanks for reading, everyone. I apologize for my lack of presence in the comments recently, but with NY Comic Con only a few weeks away and coworkers calling out sick/taking vacations and helping my mother with her new parrot (he’s a rescue and was abused)…I’ve been having a difficult time getting moments to myself.

Rest assured I am still working on parts 2 and 3 for the MGTOW Results, and will be posting those soon. I’ll most likely make a compilation post (or page) when all is said and done that collects all my MGTOW links for easier reading.

Hope all my readers and friends are doing well. I appreciate all of your input, ideas, and stories, even if I can’t reply as much as I’d like right now. Thanks for staying around. 😀

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11 thoughts on “Egalitarian Does NOT Mean Misogynist

  1. https://uwspace.uwaterloo.ca/bitstream/handle/10012/6958/Yeung_Amy.pdf;jsessionid=FB488C1B98BC7A23439F156E7F99D5C1?sequence=1

    But egalitarianism IS misogyny, at least from the common perspective. This is a masters thesis studying just this affect and it comes to the conclusion that if men don’t treat women BETTER than other men, they are perceived to be misogynistic. Feminism is Feminism, not egalitarianism because actual equal treatment would be perceived to be misogyny. Feminism wants to end what they perceive as misogyny, and that means treating women better than men, not equal to men.

  2. Thanks for the link, GNL. I’ll read it tonight.

    I’ve certainly noticed this, especially in my line of work (hobby store, 98% male, 2% female demographic). When the guys poke fun at each other or punch each other in the arm/back, it’s pretty much understood that it’s all in fun. Absolutely no one gets upset unless the name calling gets too personal…and even then, apologies happen quickly when the offender realizes that they went too far.

    Do the same to the women (aka treat them like one of the guys) and you now have a very pissed off woman who comes up to my register claiming harassment, bullying, or sexism. Only myself and one other regular female customer seem to actually enjoy being treated equally…Otherwise, it’s like walking on eggshells and not always as much fun.

  3. I remember when I was contemplating attending college at an advanced age.
    Many colleges insist that their students attend a race and sex seminor. I don’t
    know the percise title. I was afraid that I’d be put on the spot, so I asked an
    accquiantece how I should respond if queried about these topics. He said:
    “Just say that people should treat people as they wish to be treated.”
    It’s the eternal “Golden Rule.” We wouldn’t need to worry about racism or
    sexism, if we would just treat people the way we ourselves wish to be treated.
    You don’t want people to feel you up in a public locale, then you don’t feel
    them up.
    Of course, there are some crude people who don’t follow the Golden Rule,
    but there’s nothing we can do about it. When our number is up, it’s up.
    Nobody said life was fair. How we behave tells others about US. How others
    behave tells us about them.

  4. If feminism was about “equality”-how come they used to shout “men are pigs.”

    Remember awhile back when I complained Futrelle misquoted me and I had to show 37 pieces of evidence and I still wasn’t given the benefit of the doubt by that male feminist guy…

    (The quote about male sexuality being worthless by “paying for it.”)

    How come feminists think “ironic misandry” is okay but get super angry when an MRA writes a “Smack up a Violent B*tch” article?

    I’m starting to think privilege is demanding that others give a benefit of the doubt to you that you are unwilling to give them.

    It has been proven that Futrelle lies but he is still cited as a credible source…

    check this out:

    http://www.feministcritics.org/blog/2014/08/04/its-a-real-mystery-as-to-what-prompts-people-to-become-anti-feminists-noh/

  5. I remember, Stoner. I’m still in agreement with what you pointed out.

    The problem as I see it is that mainstream feminism is a strict ideology, similar to political or religious ones. As I tried to make clear in this post, just because I (and other egalitarians) don’t see eye to eye with said ideology doesn’t mean we want women to be “barefoot and pregnant”. Yet I experience the same type of condemnations from feminists as I do from Christians or diehard liberals and conservatives…Basically, if you don’t believe in parts of X ideology, you must necessarily be against all aspects of it. This is why I can profess a love for my neighbor, volunteer at soup kitchens and the spca, follow the Golden Rule, and essentially lead a good life spent trying to help others…but I’m still “going to Hell” because I don’t believe in Jesus or original sin. It is the same with some (not all) feminists, as I already illustrated.

  6. One word: gynocentrism. When you state true equality, women don’t like it, because to them it never was about equality, but female privilage. And with being egalitarian (which I am myself 100% as well) you take that away. Women responding angry about that only shows their true colors and intentions.

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